The Conversation -- August 4, 2023

** Jamelle Bouie of the New York Times: "If we truly hope to avoid another Jan. 6, or something worse, we have to deal with our undemocratic system as much as we do with the perpetrators of that particular incident. Whatever benefits our unusual rules and procedures are supposed to have are more than outweighed, at this point in our history, by the danger they pose to the entire American experiment. The threat to the integrity of the Republic is coming, as it often has, from inside the house." MB: This is Bouie's conclusion; read his entire column to understand how he got there. ~~~

     ~~~ Marie: For more insights into how we got here, see Jack M.'s commentary in today's thread.

Marie: Please scroll down & read the linked ** Reuters story on Aileen Cannon. It's scary.

Famous Last Words of One-term Presidents

In a few days I will lay down my official responsibilities in this office, to take up once more the only title in our democracy superior to that of President, the title of citizen. -- President Jimmy Carter, January 14, 1981

Can you believe I lost to this fucking guy? -- President* Donald Trump, mid-November 2020

Glenn Thrush & Charlie Savage of the New York Times: "... Donald J. Trump appeared in federal court in Washington[, D.C.,] on Thursday for the first time to face charges that he conspired to remain in office despite his 2020 election loss, pleading not guilty at a hearing conducted in the shadow of the Capitol, where his supporters, fueled by his lies, had rampaged to block the peaceful transfer of power. Mr. Trump was booked and fingerprinted before entering the courtroom and offering a soft-spoken 'not guilty' to each of the four counts lodged against him on Tuesday by Jack Smith, the special counsel.... A first pretrial hearing was set for Aug. 28." Politico's report is here.

Dan Mangan of CNBC: "Seven federal judges sat in the D.C. courthouse and watched while Trump was arraigned by their magistrate judge colleague. Th group included Chief Judge James Boasberg, and judges Amy Berman Jackson and Randy Moss, who were with four others in the back row of the room. Jackson has presided over a number of criminal cases involving Trump associates. Trump, while president in 2020, blasted her in a tweet as she prepared to sentence his longtime advisor Roger Stone, the notorious Republican self-described trickster...." This is part of a liveblog. (Also linked yesterday.)

If you fail to comply with any of the conditions of your release, a warrant may be issued for your arrest, your conditions of release may be revoked, and you may be held pending trial in this case. Your most important condition of release, sir, is that you not commit a state, federal or local crime while on release. I want to remind you that it is a crime to try to influence a juror, or to threaten or attempt to bribe a witness or any other person who may have information about your case, or to retaliate against anyone for providing information about our case to the prosecution, or to otherwise obstruct the administration of justice. -- Magistrate Judge Moxila A. Upadhyaya, to Donald Trump, arraignment August 3, 2023

~~~ Brett Samuels of the Hill: "The warning to Trump is notable given the House committee that investigated the Jan. 6 attack on the Capitol alleged the former president and his allies tried to contact and influence a witness in that probe. Former Rep. Liz Cheney (R-Wyo.) said at a hearing last summer that Trump tried to call an unnamed witness. She separately described a case of a witness describing receiving phone calls reminding them that Trump was paying attention to who said what." (Also linked yesterday afternoon.) ~~~

     ~~~ Joy Reid of MSNBC pointed out on air that these instructions -- don't commit a crime, don't tamper with a jury member, don't speak to or mess with witnesses -- sound like instructions a judge would give a mob boss.

** "Clueless" Star Presides in Trump Florida Trial. Sarah Lynch & Jacqueline Thomsen of Reuters: "The judge in ... Donald Trump's upcoming trial over his handling of classified documents made two key errors in a June trial, one of which violated a fundamental constitutional right of the defendant and could have invalidated the proceedings, according to legal experts and a court transcript. Florida-based U.S. District Judge Aileen Cannon closed jury selection for the trial of an Alabama man - accused by federal prosecutors of running a website with images of child sex abuse - to the defendant's family and the general public, a trial transcript obtained by Reuters showed. A defendant's right to a public trial is enshrined in the U.S. Constitution's Sixth Amendment.... Legal experts said closing a courtroom to the public has been recognized by the U.S. Supreme Court as a 'structural error' - a mistake so significant that it can invalidate a criminal trial because it strikes at the heart of the entire process.... Cannon ... declined to open the courtroom to the public despite repeated requests from both prosecutors and defense attorneys, the transcript showed.... [Scott] Berry, the federal defender, argued in the courtroom that Cannon's refusal to let his client's mother and sister be present during jury selection was a Sixth Amendment violation. 'All right, thank you. Your objection is overruled,' Cannon replied.... Cannon ... also neglected to swear in the prospective jury pool - an obligatory procedure in which people who may serve on the panel pledge to tell the truth during the selection process. This error forced Cannon to re-start jury selection before the trial ended abruptly with defendant William Spearman pleading guilty...." ~~~

     ~~~ Marie: Mind you, Cannon didn't make these fundamental mistakes back in her younger days. She made them less than two months ago. If, by any chance, Trump's trial ever takes place and if he is found guilty, he is almost guaranteed to win an acquittal on appeal because Cannon will likely have made more than one "structural error." This woman is so stubborn in her ignorance that not only does she not know what we learned in 9th-grade civics class about the Sixth Amendment, she won't even accept coaching on the subject from both prosecution and defense attorneys.

Mikey Is Getting Downright Voluble. Maggie Haberman of the New York Times: "Former Vice President Mike Pence on Wednesday said that ... Donald J. Trump and his advisers had tried to get him 'essentially to overturn the election' and that the American people needed to know it. The remarks, made in an interview with Fox News, are some of Mr. Pence's most pointed to date about what he experienced in the weeks leading up to Jan. 6, 2021, when he presided over the congressional certification of Joseph R. Biden Jr.'s victory.... 'It wasn't just that they asked for a pause. The president specifically asked me and his gaggle of crackpot lawyers asked me to literally reject votes.'" (Also linked yesterday afternoon.) ~~~

     ~~~ The Context. Robert Farley of FactCheck.org: "In an interview hours after ... Donald Trump was indicted for an alleged conspiracy to overturn the 2020 presidential election, one of his attorneys said that all Trump had ultimately asked his vice president to do was 'simply pause' the Electoral College count at the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021. On Fox News the following night, Aug. 2, former Vice President Mike Pence called that claim 'completely false.' Pence said Trump and his 'gaggle of crackpot lawyers' asked him 'to literally reject votes.'" (Also linked yesterday afternoon.) ~~~

     ~~~ Adam Gabbatt of the Guardian fills out Pence's remark: "The president specifically asked me, and his gaggle of crackpot lawyers asked me, to literally reject votes, which would have resulted in the issue being turned over to the House of Representatives, and literally chaos would have ensued." (Also linked yesterday afternoon.)

The Trials of Rudy. Jonah Bromwich of the New York Times: "Already identified as a co-conspirator in the latest indictment of Donald J. Trump, Rudolph W. Giuliani faced further embarrassment this week when a woman suing him for sexual assault and harassment revealed an assortment of disparaging remarks she said he had made. The woman, Noelle Dunphy, filed a lawsuit in May claiming that Mr. Giuliani, the former mayor of New York City, began harassing and assaulting her shortly after he hired her in January 2019. Mr. Giuliani has responded that Ms. Dunphy was never his employee and that the two had a consensual relationship. Ms. Dunphy said in her lawsuit that she had audio recordings that supported her claims. The recordings themselves have not been made public. In the transcripts filed on Tuesday by Ms. Dunphy's lawyer, Justin T. Kelton, Mr. Giuliani uses a homophobic slur, makes disparaging remarks about Jews and women and uses sexually explicit language in conversation with Ms. Dunphy.... In [one excerpt], he engaged in a derisive discussion of the size of Jewish men's genitals."

     ~~~ Marie: To give you an idea of how stupid & bigoted Rudy is, there's this from the Times story: "In one excerpt, he complains that the Jewish people continue to celebrate the ancient holiday of Passover. 'Jews,' he says. 'They want to go through that freaking Passover all the time. Man, oh, man. Get over the Passover. It was like 3,000 years ago. OK, the Red Sea parted. Big deal. Not the first time that happened.'" Dear Former Altar Boy Rudy: Christians celebrate the Passover not once a year, but every single day. They call it "Holy Communion" or the "Eucharist," which is a remembrance of Jesus' Last Supper, a Passover feast. The Eucharist is a central sacrament of the Christian faith. If anything, Passover is more important to Christians than it is to Jews.

Another "Star Witness" Disputes GOPS Claims. Jacqueline Alemany of the Washington Post: "Devon Archer, Hunter Biden's former business partner..., testified before investigators working for the House Oversight and Accountability Committee this week, a transcript of which was released Thursday, hours before the arraignment of ... Donald Trump.... The 141-page transcript ... includes multiple occasions in which Archer ... testified in definitive terms that Hunter Biden was not able to influence his father's actions or policy decisions and that 'nothing of material' was ever discussed with Joe Biden during his frequent communications with his son.... And Archer also disputed claims being pushed by Oversight Committee Chairman James Comer (R- Ky.) and Republican lawmakers that Biden had accepted a bribe from a foreign national while he served as vice president ... in exchange for a desired policy outcome.... Archer was touted by House Republicans as the linchpin in a quest to corroborate unsubstantiated claims that President Biden was involved in his son's foreign business affairs." ~~~

     ~~~ Marie: So once again, we learn that Hunter was/is a sleazy opportunist -- kinda like Ivanka Trump & Jared $2BB Kushner, both of whom held high-level government jobs, and like the Trump patriarch himself. Fellows, why aren't you out investigating the real criminals? ~~~

     ~~~ Philip Bump of the Washington Post: After Devon Archer testified, Jim Comer -- who did not attend the hearing -- and Jim Jordan went on Fox "News" and lied about what Archer had said under oath. "Consider the first words out of Comer's mouth in that interview with [Sean] Hannity: 'Every day this bribery scandal becomes more credible.' In fact, Archer's testimony pointed precisely in the opposite direction. That's the pattern here. Comer and Jordan and others hype claims of Joe Biden's involvement in Hunter Biden's work only to see those claims collapse as more information is made public. Devon Archer's testimony was hailed as a central breakthrough in implicating Joe Biden. Instead, it has a top ally of Hunter Biden stating under penalty of perjury that Joe Biden was not involved in Hunter Biden's business and that Biden's trip to Ukraine in 2015 was not centered on protecting Burisma at all."

Presidential Race 2024

We're going to have all of these deep state people, you know, we are going to start slitting throats on day one. -- Ron DeSantis, Sunday ~~~

~~~ First, Kill All the Bureaucrats. Julia Manchester of the Hill: "Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis (R) on Sunday said he would 'start slitting throats on day one' when it comes to taking on the 'deep state.' DeSantis made the remarks at a barbecue campaign event in Rye, N.H., hosted by former Sen. Scott Brown (R-N.H.)." MB: Actually, that's (R-Mass.). (Also linked yesterday.) ~~~

~~~ Hannah Knowles & Lisa Rein of the Washington Post: "On Thursday, as [his] comments drew more attention, two prominent unions representing tens of thousands of federal workers called on DeSantis to retract his words. Tony Reardon, national president of the National Treasury Employees Union -- which represents about 150,000 employees at the Internal Revenue Service and 30 other federal agencies -- called the comments 'repulsive and unworthy of the presidential campaign trail' in a statement. Everett Kelley, national president of the American Federation of Government Employees, said in a statement that 'violent anti-government rhetoric from politicians has deadly consequences'' pointing to a pro-Trump's mob's storming of the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021."

Tennessee. Andrew Jeong of the Washington Post: "Two Tennessee Democrats who were expelled from the state legislature in April over their participation in a gun-control protest won back their seats late Thursday. Reps. Justin J. Pearson (D-Memphis) and Justin Jones (D-Nashville) easily defeated their Republican opponents in districts that lean Democrat, according to unofficial results.... Pearson and Jones were labeled as members of the 'Tennessee Three,' along with Rep. Gloria Johnson (D-Knoxville), after the GOP-led state House voted to expel Jones and Pearson for joining protesters demanding stronger gun control legislation at the state Capitol. The protest came in the wake of a shooting in Nashville that had left three children and three adults dead." The NBC News story is here.

Texas. Stephanie Saul of the New York Times: "Texas A&M University acknowledged on Thursday that top university officials, fearing criticism from conservatives, had made 'significant mistakes' in their failed effort to hire a prominent Black professor to run the university's journalism program. It said it had reached a $1 million settlement with the professor, Kathleen McElroy. The university released a report by its general counsel that casts an unfavorable light on the behind-the-scenes discussions over Dr. McElroy's hiring, revealing that university officials had pushed for a delay in Dr. McElroy's hiring until after the state legislative session adjourned, fearing a possible backlash from conservative lawmakers. Then, following complaints about her hiring from university regents, they changed the terms of her contract.... Dr. McElroy, who had run the journalism program at the University of Texas and was formerly an editor at The New York Times, announced in July that she would not take the job, less than a month after Texas A&M had held a public signing ceremony to welcome her, complete with balloons."

The Conversation -- August 3, 2023

The Washington Post is live-updating Trump's arraignment, not that you and I will be able to see the proceedings. Ken Delanian of NBC News said this morning that the courtroom/secret chamber provides seating for 5 members of the public and 11 journalists. (Scroll on down to Dan Mangan's post to learn who did get seats in the courtroom.) ~~~

~~~ The New York Times' live updates Thursday are here: Glenn Thrush: "... Donald J. Trump pleaded not guilty on Thursday to charges that he conspired to remain in office despite his 2020 election loss, appearing before a judge in a Washington courthouse in the shadow of the Capitol, where his supporters rampaged in an effort to undermine the peaceful transfer of power.... The same courthouse where Mr. Trump appeared before Magistrate Judge Moxila A. Upadhyaya to face the charges brought by the special counsel, Jack Smith, has already hosted a stream of trials for Trump supporters accused of attacking the Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021." ~~~

     ~~~ Charlie Savage: Prosecutor Thomas "Windom tells the judge that the parties have agreed that, as a condition of release, Trump must not violate federal or state law, must appear in court as directed and must sign an appearance bond. He must not communicate with anyone he knows to be a witness, except through his lawyers or in the presence of his lawyers.... Upadhyaya ... [warns] Trump against violating the conditions of release.... If he fails to comply, a warrant may be issued for his arrest, the conditions of release may be revoked, and he may be held pending trial and receive a longer sentence. He could also be charged with contempt of court." MB: Not mentioned here, but emphasized during MSNBC coverage as a condition of bail, is the requirement that Trump not tamper with a jury member. Andrew Weissmann said this condition along with the condition that the Defendant not commit any crimes were, well, unusual. ~~~

~~~ Brett Samuels of the Hill: "The magistrate judge handling former President Trump's arraignment on charges related to trying to overturn the 2020 election warned him Thursday against bribing or influencing witnesses. U.S. Magistrate Judge Moxila Upadhyaya reminded Trump during the arraignment proceedings that bribing, influencing or retaliating against witnesses is a crime.... The warning to Trump is notable given the House committee that investigated the Jan. 6 attack on the Capitol alleged the former president and his allies tried to contact and influence a witness in that probe. Former Rep. Liz Cheney (R-Wyo.) said at a hearing last summer that Trump tried to call an unnamed witness. She separately described a case of a witness describing receiving phone calls reminding them that Trump was paying attention to who said what." ~~~

     ~~~ Joy Reid of MSNBC pointed out on air that these instructions -- don't commit a crime, don't tamper with a jury member, don't speak to or mess with witnesses -- sound like instructions a judge would give a mob boss. ~~~

~~~ Dan Mangan of CNBC: "Seven federal judges sat in the D.C. courthouse and watched while Trump was arraigned by their magistrate judge colleague. The group included Chief Judge James Boasberg, and judges Amy Berman Jackson and Randy Moss, who were with four others in the back row of the room. Jackson has presided over a number of criminal cases involving Trump associates. Trump, while president in 2020, blasted her in a tweet as she prepared to sentence his longtime advisor Roger Stone, the notorious Republican self-described trickster...." This is part of a liveblog.

Mikey Is Getting Downright Voluble. Maggie Haberman of the New York Times: "Former Vice President Mike Pence on Wednesday said that ... Donald J. Trump and his advisers had tried to get him 'essentially to overturn the election' and that the American people needed to know it. The remarks, made in an interview with Fox News, are some of Mr. Pence's most pointed to date about what he experienced in the weeks leading up to Jan. 6, 2021, when he presided over the congressional certification of Joseph R. Biden Jr.'s victory.... 'It wasn't just that they asked for a pause. The president specifically asked me and his gaggle of crackpot lawyers asked me to literally reject votes.'" ~~~

     ~~~ The Context. Robert Farley of FactCheck.org: "In an interview hours after ... Donald Trump was indicted for an alleged conspiracy to overturn the 2020 presidential election, one of his attorneys said that all Trump had ultimately asked his vice president to do was 'simply pause' the Electoral College count at the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021. On Fox News the following night, Aug. 2, former Vice President Mike Pence called that claim 'completely false.' Pence said Trump and his 'gaggle of crackpot lawyers' asked him 'to literally reject votes.'" ~~~

     ~~~ Adam Gabbatt of the Guardian fills out Pence's remark: "The president specifically asked me, and his gaggle of crackpot lawyers asked me, to literally reject votes, which would have resulted in the issue being turned over to the House of Representatives, and literally chaos would have ensued."

We're going to have all of these deep state people, you know, we are going to start slitting throats on day one. -- Ron DeSantis, Sunday ~~~

~~~ First, Kill All the Bureaucrats. Julia Manchester of the Hill: "Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis (R) on Sunday said he would 'start slitting throats on day one' when it comes to taking on the 'deep state.' DeSantis made the remarks at a barbecue campaign event in Rye, N.H., hosted by former Sen. Scott Brown (R-N.H.)." MB: Actually, that's (R-Mass.).

~~~~~~~~~~

American Carnage. He leaves in his wake ruined lives.... The people who went up to Capitol Hill, these individuals, many of the people who served him in government that got sucked into things, he just leaves all this carnage in his wake. -- Bill Barr, in a CNN interview Wednesday

Annals of "Journalism," Ctd. Marie: The top story in the New York Times today, by Michael Schmidt & Maggie Haberman, is a gigantic gift to Donald Trump in the same way Schmidt's stories about Hillary Clinton's emails were a gigantic gift to Donald Trump. The story's headline is "Trump Election Charges Set Up Clash of Lies Versus Free Speech," and most of the story is about Trump's defense claiming he has a First Amendment right to lie. Any reader who gets as far as Paragraph 16 (i.e., almost no one) will learn that "Legal experts were skeptical about the strength of those [First Amendment] claims as a defense." That is, the part of the story that most readers will absorb is that part that makes Trump's fake argument for him. And even way down the story where a "legal expert" gets a say, the story poses him as a toady for the prosecutor, a Duke professor who is himself a former prosecutor. He is cast as the second side of he-said/they-said. It's merely the prosecutors' and expert's opinion that masterminding a bank robbery is not protected speech. And, wow, this pointy-headed, elite prosecutorial "expert" -- in concert with the "deranged, deep-state Biden DOJ" -- seems to oppose your Bill of Rights freeeedoms! I wonder if Trump has Schmidt & Haberman on retainer. ~~~

~~~ MEANWHILE. Devlin Barrett & Josh Dawsey of the Washington Post: "Donald Trump's trial for allegedly conspiring to overturn the results of the 2020 election may hinge on a long-debated aspect of the former president's mind-set: How much, or if, he believes his own false claims.... Central to special counsel Jack Smith's case is the accusation that Trump knew his claims were lies. Evidence of a defendant's intent is often critical to criminal prosecutions, and it may be the most crucial element of Smith's case against Trump." The reporters then cite "a veteran D.C. lawyer" named Robert Kelner who claims Smith "needs to show that all of the false statements Trump made about the election ... were understood by Trump to be false; otherwise, it becomes a case about political speech and First Amendment rights, and that's not where the government wants to be." MB: I'm not sure that's true, either. If, as in my hypothetical example above, you mastermind a bank robbery, nobody cares whether or not you thought robbing the bank was the right thing to do. Your instructions to your criminal crew are not protected speech. ~~~

     ~~~ Marie: Speaking to Chris Hayes of MSNBC Wednesday, Rick Hasan provided a more closely analogous example: If Trump had told Pence that he would break Pence's legs & murder his children if Pence accepted Wisconsin's slate of Biden electors, that would still have been a crime, even if Trump really, really believed he Trump had won the election in Wisconsin.  

Greg Sargent of the Washington Post points to a better Trump defense: Trump's "defense lawyer, John Lauro, went on Fox News and telegraphed his coming strategy.... He declared that Trump merely acted on what he thought was reasonable advice from his lawyer, John Eastman.... This suggests that an 'advice of counsel' argument will be central to Trump's defense.... 'I've always thought this might be his strongest argument,' New York University law professor Ryan Goodman, who has written extensively about the case, told me. Though Goodman believes this 'won't work,' he said it deserves more attention.... Clearly Trump knew Eastman's theory was baloney. But the rub is getting 12 jurors to agree -- not to mention, perhaps, five Supreme Court justices."

Maggie Haberman & others at the New York Times find evidence that Co-conspirator 6 is Trump advisor Boris Epshteyn. unwashed noted the other day that Marcy Wheeler had speculated Co-conspirator 6 was Mike Roman. Wheeler since has updated her post to note the NYT speculation.

At long last, it dawns on Mikey that Donald is not qualified to be president* (also embedded yesterday afternoon): ~~~

Marie: The most surprising thing to me about the latest Trump indictment is how little of it is new. The indictment does fill in some blank spots in the narrative with a few -- significant -- bits of information. Some of these new bits obviously came from Mike Pence. Otherwise, there is little in the indictment that the House January 6 committee and the new media have not covered.

     If the Mar-a-Lago indictments incorporated some cliffhangers, the entire coup indictment is cloaked in mystery. It doesn't name the co-conspirators (which is standard DOJ practice for unindicted co-conspirators). It doesn't tell us whether or not these co-conspirators will be indicted. Why, maybe they'll cop a plea and cooperate!

     It tells us almost nothing about Mark Meadows, a critical player in the scheme. He is not among the co-conspirators cited, yet the House committee findings as well as public reporting suggest he was deeply involved in the conspiracy to find election fraud and otherwise aided and abetted Trump's crime spree. Meadows gets only glancing mention in the indictment (p. 14), and only that entry on page 14 suggests he might have been a source. But we do know he appeared before the grand jury; we just can't be sure whether he spilled the beans or if his time in the hot seat was a Fifth Amendment lollapalooza.

     And what about that January 6 phone call between Trump and Kevin in which Trump tells Kevin the insurrectionists were "more upset about the election than you are"? Jose Pagliery of the Daily Beast points out that the two-person conversation is one of the few incidents cited in the indictment without sourcing? Did My Kevin flip? Was there a recording? Is Meadows the source?

     We also know from public reporting that DOJ investigators and the grand jury heard from many witnesses whose input is not reflected in the indictment. A huge blank in the indictment is what-all happened surrounding Trump's January 6 speech at the Ellipse. The indictment does not include any mention of Trump's behavior immediately before and after his notorious remarks, although some remarks themselves are covered in the indictment. Cassidy Hutchinson described this behavior in dramatic detail, and the prosecutors later spoke with first-hand witnesses to Hutchinson's second-hand testimony. Maybe the additional information is superfluous to this particular indictment -- or maybe another indictment or indictments are in the offing. We have no idea. Clearly, the indictment is not an exhaustive review of the evidence prosecutors have against the Conspirator-in-Chief.

MEANWHILE, in Florida. Perry Stein & Josh Dawsey of the Washington Post: "Special counsel Jack Smith has asked Judge Aileen M. Cannon for a hearing to discuss whether the lawyer who represents one of Donald Trump's co-defendants in the classified documents case has too many conflicts to provide adequate legal advice to his client. In a court filing Wednesday, prosecutors said Stanley Woodward -- the lawyer for Trump valet Waltine 'Walt' Nauta -- has represented at least seven other clients whom prosecutors have interviewed about Trump's alleged efforts to keep classified documents in defiance of the government's demand they be returned. Two of Woodward's clients could be called as government witnesses in the trial, the filing said.... Prosecutors said in the filing that they told Woodward earlier that at least one of his clients had incriminating information against Nauta. That client appears to be a Mar-a-Lago IT worker named Yuscil Taveras. The Washington Post has previously reported that Taveras retained a new lawyer July 5 and eventually offered information implicating Trump, Nauta and [Mar-a-Lago property manager Carlos] De Oliveira in the alleged effort to delete surveillance footage." ~~~

     ~~~ Marie: Isn't it odd how people have to get new, non-Trumpy lawyers to tell the truth? The ostensible question here is whether Nauta can get a fair trial with adequate assistance of counsel, which is his Sixth Amendment right. But what about Taveras -- or the other government witness Woodward represents or represented? While Woodward was his counsel, it's certainly possible that Taveras told the lawyer negative things about himself. Maybe Woodward asked, for instance, "Is there anything about you or in your background that could help prosecutors make you seem like an unreliable witness?" Taveras might then have given Woodward information that could make him seem untruthful. Woodward, armed with that attorney-client privileged information, could still manage to "find" it and use it against Taveras during the trial.

Dinner for Three at the Bedminster Club. Jonathan Swan & Maggie Haberman of the New York Times: "Shortly after learning he was being indicted a third time..., Donald J. Trump had a private dinner with the top leadership at Fox News as they lobbied him to attend the first Republican presidential primary debate this month, three people familiar with the event said. The dinner between Mr. Trump, the Fox News president Jay Wallace and the network's chief executive, Suzanne Scott, was held in a private dining room at Mr. Trump's golf club in Bedminster, N.J...."

Another TuKKKer Conspiracy Theory Bites the Dust. Ryan Reilly of NBC News: ";A Donald Trump fan who participated in the Jan. 6 attack and then was the subject of a conspiracy theory on Tucker Carlson's former Fox News show was arrested by the FBI on Wednesday. Rally Runner, formerly known as Daniel Donnelly Jr., was arrested in St. Louis, Missouri, according to court records. Runner faces five federal charges, including obstructing, impeding, and interfering with law enforcement officers during a civil disorder. Back in 2021, Joseph McBride, a lawyer who was then representing several Jan. 6 defendants, said on Carlson's show that Runner was 'clearly a law enforcement officer' and an 'agent provocateur' who had only dressed up as a Trump fan as part of a scheme to make Trump fans look bad. In fact, Runner was a real Trump fan, as well as a St. Louis Cardinals fanatic who ran around the stadium during home games, thus his name change."

Could Either of These Kids Be President When He Grows Up? Maggie Astor of the New York Times: Ron DeSantis has agreed to California Gov. Gavin Newsom's challenge to a debate on Fox "News" hosted by Sean Hannity. The debate may happen in early November of this year.

Sky Palma of the Raw Story: "Despite going on cable news Monday to tout the 'bombshell' testimony Devon Archer, a longtime business partner of President Joe Biden's son Hunter, would present to his House Oversight Committee, chairman Rep. James Comer (R-KY) skipped the hearing, The Daily Beast reported. Sources speaking to The Beast said Comer was neither present on Capitol Hill for the interview, nor did he participate remotely." MB: Wait! This was the bombshell interview that would get Joe Biden impeached, convicted, sent to prison for life or maybe hanged by the neck from the nearest cherry tree -- and Comer was MIA? Well, I nevah!

If You Thought It Was Winter in South America.... Ian Livingston of the Washington Post: "It's the middle of winter in South America, but that hasn't kept the heat away in Chile, Argentina and surrounding locations. Multiple spells of oddly hot weather have roasted the region in recent weeks. The latest spell early this week has become the most intense, pushing the mercury above 100 degrees Fahrenheit, while setting an August record for Chile.... Weather historian Thierry Goose tweeted that this was an 'extraordinary winter heatwave' for Chile as the temperature climbed to 101.7 degrees (38.7 Celsius), a national record for August."

The Conversation -- August 2, 2023

At long last, it dawns on Mike that Donald is not qualified to be president*: ~~~

Marie: Last night all the serious teevee pundits were saying what a sad day it was for America. Me? I'm with Hillary (thanks to Patrick for the link): ~~~

Alright, who made this?! 😂🤣 pic.twitter.com/sEXaRPWkum

— ᗰᗩƳᖇᗩ ℙ𝕙𝕠𝕥𝕠𝕘𝕣𝕒𝕡𝕙𝕪 (@LePapillonBlu2) August 1, 2023

United States of America v. Donald J. Trump

The attack on our nation's Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021, was an unprecedented assault on the seat of American democracy. It was fueled by lies, lies by the defendant. -- Jack Smith, August 1 ~~~

~~~ Devlin Barrett, et al., of the Washington Post: "A grand jury indicted ... Donald Trump on Tuesday for a raft of alleged crimes in his brazen efforts to overturn Joe Biden's election victory -- the latest legal and political aftershock stemming from the riot at the U.S. Capitol two and a half years ago. The four-count, 45-page indictment accuses Trump ... of conspiring to defraud the United States, conspiring to obstruct an official proceeding, attempting to obstruct an official proceeding and conspiring against people's civil right to have their vote counted.... 'Despite having lost, the Defendant was determined to remain in power,' the indictment charges, accusing Trump of unleashing a blizzard of false claims about purported mass voter fraud and then trying to get state, local and federal officials to act to change the vote results. 'These claims were false, and the Defendant knew that they were false,' the indictment states. 'In fact, the Defendant was notified repeatedly that his claims were untrue -- often by the people on whom he relied for candid advice on important matters, and who were best positioned to know the facts -- and he deliberately disregarded the truth.'" The AP's story is here. The New York Times story is here.

According to MSNBC, Trump has been summoned to appear in court Thursday. Update: at 4:00 pm ET.

@6:30 pm ET, MSNBC reports that AG Merrick Garland will speak within the hour. Update: Here's what Garland said, which was not much. ~~~

     ~~~ Rebecca Shabad of NBC News: "In brief remarks outside an event in Philadelphia [Tuesday night], Attorney General Merrick Garland said that career employees of the Justice Department 'engaged in what has become the largest investigation in our history. In order to underline the department's commitment to accountability and independence, Mr. Smith and his team of experienced principled career agents and prosecutors have followed the facts and the law wherever they lead,' Garland ... told reporters. 'Any questions about this matter will have to be answered by the filings made.'" From the NBC News liveblog.

Alan Feuer & Maggie Haberman of the New York Times: "... Donald J. Trump was indicted on Tuesday in connection with his widespread efforts to overturn the 2020 election following a sprawling federal investigation into his attempts to cling to power after losing the presidency to Joseph R. Biden Jr. The indictment was filed by the special counsel Jack Smith in Federal District Court in Washington. It accuses Mr. Trump of three conspiracies: one to defraud the United States, a second to obstruct an official government proceeding and a third to deprive people of civil rights provided by federal law or the Constitution.... The indictment said Mr. Trump had six co-conspirators, but it did not name them." This is a liveblog. ~~~

     ~~~ Adam Goldman: "Prosecutors said that Trump and his co-conspirators devised fraudulent slates of electors in seven states: Arizona, Georgia, Michigan, Nevada, New Mexico, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin. Some of the fake electors, the indictment said, were 'tricked' into participating in the scheme." ~~~

     ~~~ Ben Protess: "It's hard to imagine a more consequential case against a former president." MB: What makes it especially consequential is that for the first time in U.S. history (as far as I know) the indictment charges a president* for criminal acts committed while in office, answering the question, "Can a president* be held responsible for abuse of power?" Apparently so. ~~~

     ~~~ Charlie Savage: From the indictment: "... on the pretext of baseless fraud claims, the defendant pushed officials in certain states to ignore the popular vote; disenfranchise millions of voters; dismiss legitimate electors; and ultimately, cause the ascertainment of and voting by illegitimate electors in favor of the defendant." Savage: The indictment alleges Trump is guilty of "recruiting fake electors in swing states won by Biden, trying to use the power of the Justice Department to fuel election conspiracy lies, pressuring Vice President Mike Pence to delay the certification of the election or reject legitimate electors, and then exploiting the disruption caused by the Jan. 6 riot to redouble 'efforts to levy false claims of election fraud and convince members of Congress to further delay the certification based on those claims.'" ~~~

     ~~~ Luke Broadwater: "... the Justice Department charged Mr. Trump with four federal crimes, including deprivation of rights under the color of law. The 45-page indictment read like a summarized version of the select committee's sprawling 845-page tome detailing Mr. Trump's myriad attempts to stay in office."

     ~~~ Maggie Astor: "Trump likened the indictment to the actions of 'Nazi Germany in the 1930s, the former Soviet Union, and other authoritarian, dictatorial regimes,' in a statement on Truth Social. [MB: Projection!] He again accused the Justice Department of corruption and said, 'These un-American witch hunts will fail and President Trump will be re-elected to the White House so he can save our Country from the abuse, incompetence, and corruption that is running through the veins of our Country at levels never seen before.'" ~~~

     ~~~ William Rashbaum: "The prosecutors charged that Trump and his co-conspirators told copious lies about election fraud. These 'prolific lies' included 'dozens of specific claims that there had been substantial fraud in certain states,' they said, and 'that large numbers of dead, non-resident, non-citizen, or otherwise ineligible voters had cast ballots or that voting machines had changed votes for the defendant to votes for Biden.'"

** Here's the indictment against Trump, via CNN. The New York Times has an annotated indictment here. ~~~

     ~~~ Indictment Code: Andrew Weissmann guesses Conspirator 1 = Rudy Giuliani; Conspirator 2 = John Eastman; Conspirator 3 = Sidney Powell; Conspirator 4 = Jeff Clark; & Conspirator 5 = Kenneth Chesebro; not sure about Conspirator 6. MB: On the other hand, Weissmann mixed up COS Mark Meadows & pence's COS Marc Short & made some false assumptions based on that misreading. ~~~

     ~~~ Mystery Man. In a New York Times article identifying five of the conspirators, Alan Feuer writes, "... co-conspirator 6 is described as a 'political consultant' who helped to devise and implement the fake elector scheme. It could apply to several people who worked closely with Mr. Trump after the election." The Washington Post also cannot identify this person. CNN can't decide, either. MB: There are so many possibilities.

NBC News live updates are here.

~~~ ** CNN is reporting on-air that Trump has been indicted in four counts in the election interference case. The key charge is "conspiracy to defraud the United States." Jack Smith is expected to make a public statement within the hour. (It's now 5:40 pm ET). The other charges include "corruptly obstruct an official proceeding," and "conspiracy against the right to vote." This is a 45-page speaking indictment with new info. Six co-conspirators are designated by not named; they are not (yet) indicted.~~~

     ~~~ The judge assigned to the case is U.S. District Judge Tanya Chutkan. She is an Obama appointee with a background as a public defender.

Peter Baker of the New York Times: "At the core of the United States of America v. Donald J. Trump is no less than the viability of the system constructed during [the] summer [of 1787] in Philadelphia. Can a sitting president spread lies about an election and try to employ the authority of the government to overturn the will of the voters without consequence? The question would have been unimaginable just a few years ago, but the Trump case raises the kind of specter more familiar in countries with histories of coups and juntas and dictators. In effect, Jack Smith ... charged Mr. Trump with one of the most sensational frauds in the history of the United States, one 'fueled by lies' and animated by the basest of motives, the thirst for power.... The indictment wove together all the intrigue between the Nov. 3, 2020, election and the Jan. 20, 2021, inauguration into a damning tale of a president who pushed in seemingly every possible way stop the handover of the White House to the challenger who beat him.... Now the justice system and the electoral system will engage in a 15-month race to see which will decide his fate first -- and the country's. The real verdict on the Trump presidency is still to come."

Annals of "Journalism," Ctd. Marie: As I was clicking through the "dial" Tuesday evening, I noticed that PBS News Hour was on. "Hey, let's see how the 'independent journalists' at PBS are covering the Trump indictment story. They weren't. Instead, there appeared on my teevee an extended story about how Ohio is handling the expenditure of funds allocated for anti-smoking programs. Not that this long-running tale isn't important, but I would not call it the news of the day. Rather, it reminded me of the much-ridiculed 1950s BBC stories about various rodents and rare animals that were the stock subjects of early British taxpayer-supported broadcast teevee. (In fairness to PBS, I believe they did open with a report on the indictment.)

New York. Graham Kates of CBS News: "New York Attorney General Letitia James' office says it is ready to proceed with a trial stemming from its $250 million lawsuit claiming ... Donald Trump, two of his children and his company engaged in widespread fraud.... The lawsuit is seeking $250 million and sanctions that would effectively cease the company's operations in New York.... Trump, his sons Eric and Donald Trump Jr., and Ivanka Trump have all sat for depositions in the case. During Trump's first deposition, in August 2022, before the lawsuit was filed, he invoked his Fifth Amendment right against self incrimination more than 400 times.... The case is scheduled to go to trial on Oct. 2, a date the the judge in the case, Arthur Engoron, previously described as 'set in stone.' Engoron has rejected repeated attempts by Trump attorneys to push that date back."

Michigan. Neil Vigdor, et al., of the New York Times: "Matthew DePerno, a key orchestrator of efforts to help ... Donald J. Trump try to overturn the 2020 election in Michigan and an unsuccessful candidate for state attorney general last year, was arraigned on four felony charges on Tuesday, according to documents released by D.J. Hilson, the special prosecutor handling the investigation. The charges against Mr. DePerno, which include undue possession of a voting machine and a conspiracy to gain unauthorized access to a computer or computer system, come after a nearly yearlong investigation in one of the battleground states that cemented the election of Joseph R. Biden Jr. as president. Former State Representative Daire Rendon was also charged with two crimes, including a conspiracy to illegally obtain a voting machine and false pretenses." The AP's story is here.

How to Respond to Trump's Defenders. Marie: (1) If someone tells you that Trump didn't commit any crimes (for whatever reason), ask him if he's read the indictment. If the answer is "no," politely tell him he can't possibly know what he's talking about. Tell him the indictment is available online.

     (2) If someone says Trump was just exercising his First Amendment right to free speech -- as apparently Fox "News" stars & guests are currently arguing -- explain that (a) the indictment states outright that Trump has a right to lie to the public, but when he (b) switches from false statements to criminal conduct -- which the indictment spells out -- he's a criminal. That is, you can tell a lie, but you can't act on it; e.g., "I think the Vice President has the power to reject slates of electors" is protected speech. Conspiring to manufacture and submit fake slates of electors is not. You can say you would like to rob the bank; you can't rob the bank.

     (3) If someone says the whole case is a hoax devised by Joe Biden to defeat Trump in 2024, (a) tell him Joe Biden didn't pick Jack Smith, that Smith was chosen for his independence. When that fails to convince your acquaintance, (b) tell him all of the witnesses cited in the indictment are Republicans, many of them appointed to their jobs by Donald Trump. They all voted for Donald Trump, they wanted him to win, many worked to re-elect him.

New Jersey. Tracy Tulley of the New York Times reports on the sudden death of the state's Lt. Gov. Sheila Oliver.