The Conversation -- August 4, 2023
** Jamelle Bouie of the New York Times: "If we truly hope to avoid another Jan. 6, or something worse, we have to deal with our undemocratic system as much as we do with the perpetrators of that particular incident. Whatever benefits our unusual rules and procedures are supposed to have are more than outweighed, at this point in our history, by the danger they pose to the entire American experiment. The threat to the integrity of the Republic is coming, as it often has, from inside the house." MB: This is Bouie's conclusion; read his entire column to understand how he got there. ~~~
~~~ Marie: For more insights into how we got here, see Jack M.'s commentary in today's thread.
Marie: Please scroll down & read the linked ** Reuters story on Aileen Cannon. It's scary.
Famous Last Words of One-term Presidents
In a few days I will lay down my official responsibilities in this office, to take up once more the only title in our democracy superior to that of President, the title of citizen. -- President Jimmy Carter, January 14, 1981
Can you believe I lost to this fucking guy? -- President* Donald Trump, mid-November 2020
Glenn Thrush & Charlie Savage of the New York Times: "... Donald J. Trump appeared in federal court in Washington[, D.C.,] on Thursday for the first time to face charges that he conspired to remain in office despite his 2020 election loss, pleading not guilty at a hearing conducted in the shadow of the Capitol, where his supporters, fueled by his lies, had rampaged to block the peaceful transfer of power. Mr. Trump was booked and fingerprinted before entering the courtroom and offering a soft-spoken 'not guilty' to each of the four counts lodged against him on Tuesday by Jack Smith, the special counsel.... A first pretrial hearing was set for Aug. 28." Politico's report is here.
Dan Mangan of CNBC: "Seven federal judges sat in the D.C. courthouse and watched while Trump was arraigned by their magistrate judge colleague. Th group included Chief Judge James Boasberg, and judges Amy Berman Jackson and Randy Moss, who were with four others in the back row of the room. Jackson has presided over a number of criminal cases involving Trump associates. Trump, while president in 2020, blasted her in a tweet as she prepared to sentence his longtime advisor Roger Stone, the notorious Republican self-described trickster...." This is part of a liveblog. (Also linked yesterday.)
If you fail to comply with any of the conditions of your release, a warrant may be issued for your arrest, your conditions of release may be revoked, and you may be held pending trial in this case. Your most important condition of release, sir, is that you not commit a state, federal or local crime while on release. I want to remind you that it is a crime to try to influence a juror, or to threaten or attempt to bribe a witness or any other person who may have information about your case, or to retaliate against anyone for providing information about our case to the prosecution, or to otherwise obstruct the administration of justice. -- Magistrate Judge Moxila A. Upadhyaya, to Donald Trump, arraignment August 3, 2023
~~~ Brett Samuels of the Hill: "The warning to Trump is notable given the House committee that investigated the Jan. 6 attack on the Capitol alleged the former president and his allies tried to contact and influence a witness in that probe. Former Rep. Liz Cheney (R-Wyo.) said at a hearing last summer that Trump tried to call an unnamed witness. She separately described a case of a witness describing receiving phone calls reminding them that Trump was paying attention to who said what." (Also linked yesterday afternoon.) ~~~
~~~ Joy Reid of MSNBC pointed out on air that these instructions -- don't commit a crime, don't tamper with a jury member, don't speak to or mess with witnesses -- sound like instructions a judge would give a mob boss.
** "Clueless" Star Presides in Trump Florida Trial. Sarah Lynch & Jacqueline Thomsen of Reuters: "The judge in ... Donald Trump's upcoming trial over his handling of classified documents made two key errors in a June trial, one of which violated a fundamental constitutional right of the defendant and could have invalidated the proceedings, according to legal experts and a court transcript. Florida-based U.S. District Judge Aileen Cannon closed jury selection for the trial of an Alabama man - accused by federal prosecutors of running a website with images of child sex abuse - to the defendant's family and the general public, a trial transcript obtained by Reuters showed. A defendant's right to a public trial is enshrined in the U.S. Constitution's Sixth Amendment.... Legal experts said closing a courtroom to the public has been recognized by the U.S. Supreme Court as a 'structural error' - a mistake so significant that it can invalidate a criminal trial because it strikes at the heart of the entire process.... Cannon ... declined to open the courtroom to the public despite repeated requests from both prosecutors and defense attorneys, the transcript showed.... [Scott] Berry, the federal defender, argued in the courtroom that Cannon's refusal to let his client's mother and sister be present during jury selection was a Sixth Amendment violation. 'All right, thank you. Your objection is overruled,' Cannon replied.... Cannon ... also neglected to swear in the prospective jury pool - an obligatory procedure in which people who may serve on the panel pledge to tell the truth during the selection process. This error forced Cannon to re-start jury selection before the trial ended abruptly with defendant William Spearman pleading guilty...." ~~~
~~~ Marie: Mind you, Cannon didn't make these fundamental mistakes back in her younger days. She made them less than two months ago. If, by any chance, Trump's trial ever takes place and if he is found guilty, he is almost guaranteed to win an acquittal on appeal because Cannon will likely have made more than one "structural error." This woman is so stubborn in her ignorance that not only does she not know what we learned in 9th-grade civics class about the Sixth Amendment, she won't even accept coaching on the subject from both prosecution and defense attorneys.
Mikey Is Getting Downright Voluble. Maggie Haberman of the New York Times: "Former Vice President Mike Pence on Wednesday said that ... Donald J. Trump and his advisers had tried to get him 'essentially to overturn the election' and that the American people needed to know it. The remarks, made in an interview with Fox News, are some of Mr. Pence's most pointed to date about what he experienced in the weeks leading up to Jan. 6, 2021, when he presided over the congressional certification of Joseph R. Biden Jr.'s victory.... 'It wasn't just that they asked for a pause. The president specifically asked me and his gaggle of crackpot lawyers asked me to literally reject votes.'" (Also linked yesterday afternoon.) ~~~
~~~ The Context. Robert Farley of FactCheck.org: "In an interview hours after ... Donald Trump was indicted for an alleged conspiracy to overturn the 2020 presidential election, one of his attorneys said that all Trump had ultimately asked his vice president to do was 'simply pause' the Electoral College count at the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021. On Fox News the following night, Aug. 2, former Vice President Mike Pence called that claim 'completely false.' Pence said Trump and his 'gaggle of crackpot lawyers' asked him 'to literally reject votes.'" (Also linked yesterday afternoon.) ~~~
~~~ Adam Gabbatt of the Guardian fills out Pence's remark: "The president specifically asked me, and his gaggle of crackpot lawyers asked me, to literally reject votes, which would have resulted in the issue being turned over to the House of Representatives, and literally chaos would have ensued." (Also linked yesterday afternoon.)
The Trials of Rudy. Jonah Bromwich of the New York Times: "Already identified as a co-conspirator in the latest indictment of Donald J. Trump, Rudolph W. Giuliani faced further embarrassment this week when a woman suing him for sexual assault and harassment revealed an assortment of disparaging remarks she said he had made. The woman, Noelle Dunphy, filed a lawsuit in May claiming that Mr. Giuliani, the former mayor of New York City, began harassing and assaulting her shortly after he hired her in January 2019. Mr. Giuliani has responded that Ms. Dunphy was never his employee and that the two had a consensual relationship. Ms. Dunphy said in her lawsuit that she had audio recordings that supported her claims. The recordings themselves have not been made public. In the transcripts filed on Tuesday by Ms. Dunphy's lawyer, Justin T. Kelton, Mr. Giuliani uses a homophobic slur, makes disparaging remarks about Jews and women and uses sexually explicit language in conversation with Ms. Dunphy.... In [one excerpt], he engaged in a derisive discussion of the size of Jewish men's genitals."
~~~ Marie: To give you an idea of how stupid & bigoted Rudy is, there's this from the Times story: "In one excerpt, he complains that the Jewish people continue to celebrate the ancient holiday of Passover. 'Jews,' he says. 'They want to go through that freaking Passover all the time. Man, oh, man. Get over the Passover. It was like 3,000 years ago. OK, the Red Sea parted. Big deal. Not the first time that happened.'" Dear Former Altar Boy Rudy: Christians celebrate the Passover not once a year, but every single day. They call it "Holy Communion" or the "Eucharist," which is a remembrance of Jesus' Last Supper, a Passover feast. The Eucharist is a central sacrament of the Christian faith. If anything, Passover is more important to Christians than it is to Jews.
Another "Star Witness" Disputes GOPS Claims. Jacqueline Alemany of the Washington Post: "Devon Archer, Hunter Biden's former business partner..., testified before investigators working for the House Oversight and Accountability Committee this week, a transcript of which was released Thursday, hours before the arraignment of ... Donald Trump.... The 141-page transcript ... includes multiple occasions in which Archer ... testified in definitive terms that Hunter Biden was not able to influence his father's actions or policy decisions and that 'nothing of material' was ever discussed with Joe Biden during his frequent communications with his son.... And Archer also disputed claims being pushed by Oversight Committee Chairman James Comer (R- Ky.) and Republican lawmakers that Biden had accepted a bribe from a foreign national while he served as vice president ... in exchange for a desired policy outcome.... Archer was touted by House Republicans as the linchpin in a quest to corroborate unsubstantiated claims that President Biden was involved in his son's foreign business affairs." ~~~
~~~ Marie: So once again, we learn that Hunter was/is a sleazy opportunist -- kinda like Ivanka Trump & Jared $2BB Kushner, both of whom held high-level government jobs, and like the Trump patriarch himself. Fellows, why aren't you out investigating the real criminals? ~~~
~~~ Philip Bump of the Washington Post: After Devon Archer testified, Jim Comer -- who did not attend the hearing -- and Jim Jordan went on Fox "News" and lied about what Archer had said under oath. "Consider the first words out of Comer's mouth in that interview with [Sean] Hannity: 'Every day this bribery scandal becomes more credible.' In fact, Archer's testimony pointed precisely in the opposite direction. That's the pattern here. Comer and Jordan and others hype claims of Joe Biden's involvement in Hunter Biden's work only to see those claims collapse as more information is made public. Devon Archer's testimony was hailed as a central breakthrough in implicating Joe Biden. Instead, it has a top ally of Hunter Biden stating under penalty of perjury that Joe Biden was not involved in Hunter Biden's business and that Biden's trip to Ukraine in 2015 was not centered on protecting Burisma at all."
Presidential Race 2024
We're going to have all of these deep state people, you know, we are going to start slitting throats on day one. -- Ron DeSantis, Sunday ~~~
~~~ First, Kill All the Bureaucrats. Julia Manchester of the Hill: "Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis (R) on Sunday said he would 'start slitting throats on day one' when it comes to taking on the 'deep state.' DeSantis made the remarks at a barbecue campaign event in Rye, N.H., hosted by former Sen. Scott Brown (R-N.H.)." MB: Actually, that's (R-Mass.). (Also linked yesterday.) ~~~
~~~ Hannah Knowles & Lisa Rein of the Washington Post: "On Thursday, as [his] comments drew more attention, two prominent unions representing tens of thousands of federal workers called on DeSantis to retract his words. Tony Reardon, national president of the National Treasury Employees Union -- which represents about 150,000 employees at the Internal Revenue Service and 30 other federal agencies -- called the comments 'repulsive and unworthy of the presidential campaign trail' in a statement. Everett Kelley, national president of the American Federation of Government Employees, said in a statement that 'violent anti-government rhetoric from politicians has deadly consequences'' pointing to a pro-Trump's mob's storming of the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021."
Tennessee. Andrew Jeong of the Washington Post: "Two Tennessee Democrats who were expelled from the state legislature in April over their participation in a gun-control protest won back their seats late Thursday. Reps. Justin J. Pearson (D-Memphis) and Justin Jones (D-Nashville) easily defeated their Republican opponents in districts that lean Democrat, according to unofficial results.... Pearson and Jones were labeled as members of the 'Tennessee Three,' along with Rep. Gloria Johnson (D-Knoxville), after the GOP-led state House voted to expel Jones and Pearson for joining protesters demanding stronger gun control legislation at the state Capitol. The protest came in the wake of a shooting in Nashville that had left three children and three adults dead." The NBC News story is here.
Texas. Stephanie Saul of the New York Times: "Texas A&M University acknowledged on Thursday that top university officials, fearing criticism from conservatives, had made 'significant mistakes' in their failed effort to hire a prominent Black professor to run the university's journalism program. It said it had reached a $1 million settlement with the professor, Kathleen McElroy. The university released a report by its general counsel that casts an unfavorable light on the behind-the-scenes discussions over Dr. McElroy's hiring, revealing that university officials had pushed for a delay in Dr. McElroy's hiring until after the state legislative session adjourned, fearing a possible backlash from conservative lawmakers. Then, following complaints about her hiring from university regents, they changed the terms of her contract.... Dr. McElroy, who had run the journalism program at the University of Texas and was formerly an editor at The New York Times, announced in July that she would not take the job, less than a month after Texas A&M had held a public signing ceremony to welcome her, complete with balloons."
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Reader Comments (11)
“It’s all soooo injust…”
Noted literary scholar Sarah Palin, former half-term goobernator of Alaska and consumer of many newspapers, magazines, and journals, none of which she can remember, sez Fatty’s indictment is “injust”.
Unfair to knock her for that? Okay. Maybe. We all misspeak now and then, but also, we’re not all idiots.
Hockey-Grizzly Bear Mom goes on, in a spittle inflected rant, to call Trump’s Ordeal “Orwellian”, claiming that he’s being treated like someone in the book “1984”, wherein good people are forced, by a dictatorial government, to believe shit that isn’t true, and threatened by the leader if they don’t agree with his lies.
Gee, sounds a lot like the Trump administration, where Fatty calls up an elected state official, flings a lot of lies around and threatens him with jail time unless he goes along with his bullshit. Dystopian totalitarianism is an excellent description of Trumpism at its core.
Thanks, Sarah, for reminding us of what a fascist fuck you’re promoting. And for that new word.
Time, now, to return to the Land of Terminal Insignificance. Buh-bye.
https://twitter.com/HeartlandSignal/status/1687197848092196865?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1687197848092196865%7Ctwgr%5E675b7905a7049b7b1ba4e03ebae8e2fe9e596cad%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.politicususa.com%2F2023%2F08%2F03%2Fsarah-palin-says-trumps-indictment-is-injust-and-is-making-people-afraid-of-their-thoughts.html
@Akhilleus: You're being anti-just to Sarah. The only reason she has to make up fake words is that Donald Trump has all the best words.
AK: Bringing up our "Word-Smith of Wascilla" makes me yearn for the good old days when Sarah entertained us with her intellectual prowess in-between shooting moose from a plane. Thems were the good ole days when the worst thing we could do was put a whole lot of lipstick on pigs.
On another matter: some banter last night about why Fatty's lawyers are complaining about having a trial in D.C. Too many Black people reside there and horrors! the jury pool could be filled with them! Yes, sir, we wants a "FAIR" trial––-as white as we can get.
Doncha jest love equality?
Fox "News:" Where politicians go to lie...
Yesterday's misrepresentations made by Comer and Jordan about what Hunter's former business partner had to say about the Biden "scandal" are not really news. It's what we have come to expect from these congressional co-conspirators...and where we expect to find them.
But it still raises the question of why so many are eager to be lied to, why they lap up the Fox bushwa like thirsty dogs choosing to drink out out of toilets instead of clear mountain streams.
Tho they didn't show up in large numbers at yesterday's arraignment, I suspect the Trumpbots are still out there, watching Fox "News" and hoping to MAGA...
That the America they want to make great never was is an essential ingredient in the MAGA appeal.
Don't know why DeSantis is so averse to Disneyland. The Right depends on Fantasyland. They just call it Fox "News."
You might say that Sarah Palin is uncapable when it comes to the
English language. After all, her state was once part of Russia.
Trump was really upset with Judge Upadhyaya, not because of all the
restrictions she read to him, but because she called him "Mr. Trump"
when in his heart (?) he knows that he actually should be "President".
What would Emily Post say, Is it Mr. or President when addressing a
former president*? I could check the googles but don't have time,
got to get out there and try to get grass seed to grow in a drought.
https://news.yahoo.com/trump-reportedly-irked-1-word-032920490.html?.tsrc=daily_mail&uh_test=0_00
As expected PBS did cover Trump's trip to court plus they did an interview with Bill Barr. Here's part of his comments:
"Well, this case is a more serious — first, I don't think Alvin Bragg's case is a legitimate case. I think it — that is a political hit.
But I think this case is the most serious of the cases, because the conduct here involved, trying to subvert and prevent the progress, the execution of probably the most important process and proceeding we have in our country, which is the peaceful transfer of power after an election.
And what's being alleged here is that he knew that he lost the election, he knew that the claims of a stolen election were false, and yet he decided he was going to try to stay in office by subverting that process, by putting out misinformation, but, more important, by putting out these false panels of electors and presenting them to Congress and trying to push the vice president to make these decisions to suppress the legitimate votes.
I mean, that was outrageous. And putting aside whether it's criminal or know, it — I don't see how the Republican Party could nominate someone who's capable of doing something like that."
@Forrest Morris: Well, Forrest, I did check with Emily (which wasn't easy, because she's dead). According to Emily,
“When addressing a former President of the United States in a formal setting, the correct form is 'Mr. LastName.' ('President LastName' or 'Mr. President' are terms reserved for the current head of state.) This is true for other ex-officials, as well. When talking about the person to a third party, on the other hand, it’s appropriate to say, 'former President LastName.' This holds for introductions, as well: A current state governor is introduced as 'Governor Tom Smith,' while you’d introduce an ex-governor as 'former Governor Jim Bell.'”
So from now on that guy Trump is Mr. Last Name to me. Just to be polite.
Way back when I remember saying that Sarah Palin was a gateway drug. Once the ignorati beheld the Incredible Lightness of Her Intellect, they felt empowered, even compelled, to make equally weighty pronouncements without the crutches of fact or context.
When you step back, it's evident that what the Confederates are doing is consistent with what would be business as usual in the United States in 1850: The country was run by and for the benefit of what we know now were not very admirable white people whose word was law. What's happened since has convinced many in the Con camp that a step forward for anyone unwelcome in the trailer park is a step back for the proud white folks washed exclusively in the blood of the lamb everywhere. They're rebelling against events that happened over 150 years ago, which is why those who try to make sense of their actions in a modern framework can be so confused.
@Marie: Thanks for that info, however if trump ever campaigns
in Western Michigan, I will still use the title I always use and it
starts with A and ends with hole.
(My Victorian grandparents would horse whip me for using
language like that).
Instead of easing my anxiety about TFG's ever coming to justice, the latest indictment has fried my brain: I think it's a great idea to respond to TFG's wish to change venues with this counteroffer:
Okay, Let's have you trade places. You go to Aileen Cannon in FL for the Jack Smith indictments and you come up to DC for the documents case.
Every competent lawyer in the country will rein in anything Aileen tries to do in favor of ***** and ***** has no chance at all with any jury in DC.
This is the only thing that finally ensures that ***** is going down (in my fried mind).
@Marie: Thanks for providing information on the definitive method for addressing a former president. Now, what can we do about former senators, congressmen, governors, mayors, etc., who continue to to use and insist on being addressed by their prior title?